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 3. Advanced French Breads
 Pull method vs. kneading
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Sylvia Jacobus
52 Posts
Sylvia
Kent WA
USA

Posted - Mar 16 2018 :  12:01:47 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I've read oodles of sourdough books over the years. Most knead their bread, use a shorter proofing time, first proofing I mean. Most enjoy hand kneading but the KitchenAid does a nice job.
What benefits do you reap by using the pull dough method you use in the book?

Bread is like the sun. It rises in the yeast and sets in the waist. Unknown author

Ashley
288 Posts
Ashley
MOSCOW Idaho
USA

Posted - Mar 16 2018 :  1:41:01 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
When it comes to kneading by hand versus a stand mixer, I think it's a matter of personal preference. I like the tactile act of kneading by hand, but a stand mixer can be very convenient when mixing up sticky or stiff dough.

To answer your question, I hope I'm correct in thinking you're asking about the series of folds made during the first proof? There are a couple benefits to folding the dough during the first proof. When you're using wheat flours, folding the dough helps promote strong gluten-strand formation, which in turn is responsible for the air pockets that are characteristic of French-style breads. Additionally, with a strengthened gluten structure, you're able to create higher hydration breads. I've used this technique when baking both wild-yeast breads and commercial-yeast breads, and each produces superior results compared with dough just left to "rise" in the bowl.

The second reason for folding the bread dough during the first proof, which applies to both wheat flours and gluten-free flours is that it encourages even liquid distribution during proofing. Wheat flours want to take their time to soak up water, making it easy to add too much flour when mixing dough. White and brown rice flours do the opposite—they readily soak up liquids and then release them during proofing, making it easy to not add enough flour while mixing dough, only to find a soupy mess after the first proof. Quinoa is pretty middle-of-the-road, but folding prevents a "skin" from forming on top of the dough. The easiest way to explain this is to refer you to p. 69 of Wild Bread. In the upper right hand corner, there is a picture of a bowl of mixed brown rice dough before conditioning (conditioning is the word we chose to use to describe the series of folds made during the first proof). The dough looks dry and not uniform at all. In the after picture, the dough is cohesive and hydrated. Folding the dough during proofing ensures that the dough is mixed up and consistent.

Whew! That was a bit of a rambling response. I hope I answered your question!

Ashley Ogle
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Sylvia Jacobus
52 Posts
Sylvia
Kent WA
USA

Posted - Mar 17 2018 :  11:32:50 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yes, I meant the first proof. Thanks for the explanation. Makes sense. I am like a kid needing to know the "whys" and "hows" of everything I do. Too analytical mind, forgive me. And,
here's another question: how dry should the rye chops be after draining (Rustic Rye)? Use a fine strainer?

Bread is like the sun. It rises in the yeast and sets in the waist. Unknown author
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Ashley
288 Posts
Ashley
MOSCOW Idaho
USA

Posted - Mar 17 2018 :  12:52:03 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Oh, good I’m glad I answered the right question, I was worried I was going off in a different direction. ;) For the rustic rye, the soaking water just needs to be drained from the rye chops.

Ashley Ogle
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Sylvia Renate
8 Posts
Sylvia
Brush Prairie WA
USA

Posted - May 17 2018 :  11:26:35 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
From Sylvia’s post on March 16 I am assuming it is okay to use a stand mixer with the dough hooks to knead the bread most of the way. I also appreciated the explanation about folding the dough during the first proofing. Any advice about using the stand mixer?

Sylvia Renate
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Sylvia Jacobus
52 Posts
Sylvia
Kent WA
USA

Posted - May 17 2018 :  2:44:02 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I am using my stand mixer to do the bread dough. If the recipe says to knead more flour in by hand, I do that. What I found is that my doughs were super wet and weren't mixed very well. That has to do with my arthritic fingers. So thank goodness I have this mixer. My doughs behave much better now. And, I'm so glad to have warmer weather. My boule dough is bubbling after just being mixed. Love it! I have occasionally used the dough hook to knead.

Bread is like the sun. It rises in the yeast and sets in the waist. Unknown author
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Kathyinozarks
9 Posts
Kathy
ELDRIDGE Missouri
USA

Posted - Jun 03 2018 :  1:11:14 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
thanks for the good explanation-I want to try this bread gluten free

Kathyinozarks
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